3AW Neil Mitchell
E&OE
NEIL MITCHELL:
Scott Morrison, good morning.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Good morning, Neil. Good to be here.
MITCHELL:
96100693, 133032 if you’d like to speak to the Minister. You know what’s first – it’s on again, isn’t it?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well look, I’ve seen those reports overnight, and I must admit I’m a bit perplexed by them, I mean I’ve been pretty busy over the last few weeks as has the Prime Minister, getting on with the job of government over the entire time we’ve been in government and that’s what we’re on about but nothing has changed over the last couple of weeks. I think what we might be seeing here is a bit of political bedwetting by some and I think frankly we’ve got to get past that. This was dealt with a couple of weeks ago. The Australian public expect us to get on with the job and that’s what I encourage all of my colleagues to do.
MITCHELL:
It’s reported that some in the Cabinet now, a significant number in the Cabinet now do not support the Prime Minister, is that correct?
MINISTER MORRISON:
No I don’t believe it is at all. I think this is quite fanciful.
MITCHELL:
Do you support the Prime Minister unequivocally?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Of course I do.
MITCHELL:
Has anybody sounded you out about running?
MINISTER MORRISON:
No.
MITCHELL:
Not for any position?
MINISTER MORRISON:
No.
MITCHELL:
You must be disappointed by that?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well the thing is, I suppose you give off vibes Neil. When you’re giving off the vibes that you’re just getting on with your job and you want to do the right thing by the Australian people then people don’t engage you in that sort of nonsense.
MITCHELL:
Well what can Malcolm Turnbull say to put an end to it?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I don’t know what he can say other than what he’s already said. Malcolm’s a good friend of mine and I’ve seen him getting about his job as well. So look I think what you’re seeing here is a bit of low level rumbling and trying to talk itself up. I mean this matter was dealt with a couple of weeks ago. I see Luke Simpkins comments today, now Luke was the one who moved that motion, and Luke is there saying, look the party room made that decision to give Tony the opportunity to get on with the job and that’s exactly what he’s doing and so I think that’s exactly what we should continue to do.
MITCHELL:
But it has been a bad week for the government, hasn’t it?
MINISTER MORRISON:
No I don’t think it has at all, no I don’t.
MITCHELL:
The Gillian Triggs issue doesn’t matter?
MINISTER MORRISON:
I think that issue is just, I mean, who cares about that at the end of the day? What matters is that Labor put the children into detention, we got them out of detention and her Inquiry, I appeared at the Inquiry and I made my points at that time, and I think she had an agenda and all of that, that’s not surprising. She was one of many. There were lots of people who agreed with Gillian Triggs who thought the Coalition couldn’t stop the boats, well we did, the children are getting out of detention, I’ve moved on, I think people should move on on this topic and we should just get on with the good government that we’ve been delivering. And we certainly delivered it when it came to border protection.
MITCHELL:
So you’re not concerned about Gillian Triggs, yet she went after you in that report personally.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well she can go after me if she likes but she was like so many others in the media, in the Labor party, in the Greens, who all said that we couldn’t stop the boats. Well guess what? They were wrong. We were right. Our policies worked, they stopped the boats, they saved lives, they ensured that we could reduce the number of children in detention by over 90% and it still continues to fall so look, Gillian Triggs can say or think whatever she likes, I think she’s let the Commission down in the way that she approached that Inquiry, that’s disappointing but that’s for her to answer for, not for me to run a commentary on it.
MITCHELL:
Oh no, but then there’s was she offered a job to move? Was she not offered a job? The government has been contradicting itself, it looks confused.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I don’t think we have and look I think the Prime Minister, the Foreign Minister, the Attorney General have made that all pretty clear over the week. Labor’s tried to stir this up but they’re going down a dry gully. They’ve had a week to talk about policy. I was at the Press Club talking about welfare reform, they’re in the House of Representatives banging on about conspiracy theories and who was on the grassy knoll and who wasn’t and all the rest of it. If Bill Shorten wants to focus on policy then he should, he says he wants to have the year of the idea, and he hasn’t had a light bulb go over his head the entire time.
MITCHELL:
Do you think Tony Abbott will lead you in to the next election?
MINISTER MORRISON:
That is certainly my hope he will, yes.
MITCHELL:
It’s your hope; do you believe it will happen?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well that’s a matter for colleagues at the end of the day. But what I’ve seen Tony doing is focusing on what we need to focus on as a country, support for families, a jobs package we’re working on now, small business package as we lead up into the Budget. National security is absolutely top of mind and there’s very good reason for that and i think he has shown great leadership in that area in particular where I served with him quite closely in my previous portfolio.
MITCHELL:
But it does seem you can’t unequivocally say he will say he will lead into the next election, that’s a matter for colleagues?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well it is a matter for colleagues, as John Howard said “Who leads the party is always a gift of the party room”…
MITCHELL:
Yeah but no one was screaming for John Howard’s head…
MINISTER MORRISON:
I think if we go back to 2006 and 2007 and on a number of other occasions, Neil, you will recall that from time to time these things do come up. John Howard was always very philosophical about those things and these things are the gift of the party room, and remember our party room is made up of people who are elected by their constituents, so that’s how the system works and I think anyone who pretends differently is kidding themselves. What proves success in government and in politics is performance and competence and that’s what were focussed on.
MITCHELL:
Well I think the competence is the issue whether the Prime Minister is rattled, whether he’s leading well. Is he leading well?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Yes I think he is, and I think there has been a lot of changes over the last few weeks in particular. There was a very strong message sent by the backbench.
MITCHELL:
What’s he changed?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I’ve noticed it in his engagement with colleagues, directly. There has been I think a breath of fresh air in terms of how the backbench in particular are now engaging with frontbenchers and let’s not forget what happened a couple of weeks ago was as much a message to the frontbench more generally as it was to Tony Abbott. I think we collectively as a front bench team have to take some responsibility for the angst that was felt on the backbench and being disconnected as they saw it and I think we’ve all had to work a lot harder to make that connection, as we should.
MITCHELL:
If Tony Abbott were to get the tap on the shoulder, or to step down, would you be a candidate for any position?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, you’re assuming he’d get a tap on the shoulder, who’s tapping him on the shoulder?
MITCHELL:
Well that’s what the reports are, that he’s gonna get a tap on the shoulder…
MINISTER MORRISON:
That’s why I don’t get into those sort of hypotheticals, I mean, a tap on the shoulder, a visit in the night. That sounds you know, not something likely that I can foresee.
MITCHELL:
Well there was a bit of a tap on the shoulder to have the spill motion in the first place.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, no I don’t think there was a tap on the shoulder…
MITCHELL:
A tap on the head… On the forehead.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Luke Simpkins made that pretty up front, I think. I don’t think there was anything subtle about that or the vote that followed.
MITCHELL:
But you know people are talking about you as a future leader?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well that’s flattering, and that’s nice. But John Howard gave me advice a long time ago when I was State Director – he said ‘do your job well’. And that’s what I do.
MITCHELL:
Would you like to be leader in the future?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Look, anyone who goes into parliament who says that they don’t aspire to do as much as they can in politics is lying to you. I would hope to do as much as I possibly can in politics because I want to serve my country and I feel I’m doing that right now in the job I have. I felt I was able to do that in a very significant way in my previous portfolio in stopping the boats and I’m very pleased we were able to achieve that result, but that’s what I see my job as in the government. I’m a fixer, I get things fixed, I get things done and that’s what I look to do in this portfolio and in welfare.
MITCHELL:
Sounds like a job application.
MINISTER MORRISON:
No, it sounds like I’m doing my job.
MITCHELL:
It’s a bit of a metamorphose though, this is the Minister for not telling us anything and now you’re everywhere.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well it takes a different approach in each portfolio Neil. In my previous portfolio, security around operational issues was critical to the success of those operations and I’ll just let the results of my approach speak for itself. The boats stopped, the deaths stopped, the children came out of detention. That was the result I hoped to achieve and we had a $2.5 billion boon for the budget as well.
MITCHELL:
If there was a change of leadership there would have to be an election wouldn’t there?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well there is an election in about 18 months Neil, that’s when it’s scheduled for.
MITCHELL:
I’ll put a scenario to you. Abbott goes, Turnbull’s elected, loses the election, you’re Opposition Leader.
MINISTER MORRISON:
I don’t want to see our Government going into Opposition under any circumstances Neil, and I don’t think the Australian people want to see Bill Shorten become Prime Minister because he talks about a festival of ideas. He has a festival of no idea when it comes to policy problems facing this country and his unfunded empathy approach to going around and talking to every interest group and tickling their ears but not presenting any solutions, I don’t think is a plan for the country.
MITCHELL:
Ok, so bed wetters?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, I think people just need to stick firm, stay with the plan. We’ve got a plan to get this country moving. We already have been implementing that plan. We’ve got good results to date. And we need to stick to that plan and get on with it.
MITCHELL:
You’re the fixer, do you ring the bed wetters and give them a smack around the ears?
MINISTER MORRISON:
You can be confident that I’ll be talking to colleagues and encouraging them to stick and hold firm, because we’ve got an important job to do and we can’t get that job done if we allow this sort of thing to distract us.
MITCHELL:
Well you see that confirms that people are unsettled. If there is a need for you to ring and give them a bash around the ears, then they are unsettled aren’t they?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Look there are a few people who have muttered, but I wouldn’t put it much beyond that. I think the substantive view was settled several weeks ago and those who raised that did it quite openly, did it upfront and I respect the decision of the Party Room and so should everyone else.
MITCHELL:
Ok let’s move on to what – well I was going to say what really matters but whose Prime Minister matters obviously. But what matters is it correct, I saw, I think it was you were quoted in this in the Australian. 80 per cent of taxpayers are actually working to pay the welfare bill.
MINISTER MORRISON:
That’s right.
MITCHELL:
80 per cent of people. All their taxes are going to welfare?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Eight out of ten income tax payers every day they go to work that is what is required to fund the hundred and fifty billion dollar bill that comes out of my portfolio. That is a wakeup call for all Australians about ensuring we get the best we can out of that investment and that the system is as targeted as it can be, it is helping those who most need it but it respects those who pay for it.
MITCHELL:
Do you want to change that figure. Would you like to see a situation were 70% of the taxpayers money went to welfare? To get the figure down, to get the percentages down?
MINISTER MORRISON:
I would like to see the money that is being spent by those eight out of ten taxpayers being spent well that is the first objective.
MITCHELL:
Better?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Absolutely better, more targeted, helping those most in need, ensuring that we crack down wherever possible on those who are taking a loan of the system. Because when they are taking a loan of the system, they are taking a loan off taxpayers who are having to push them along in the barrow.
MITCHELL:
Does that mean that going through this process at the end of a period of time fewer people on welfare?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well you would always hope that there would be fewer people on welfare. I showed a chart at the…
MITCHELL:
Is that your aim? Is that what happens?
MINISTER MORRISON:
That’s what happened under The Howard Government. We saw the percentage of people on income support payments who are in working age fall dramatically during the years of the Howard government and over the same time the percentage of people in work went up, and that is why I said this week the best form of welfare is a job. If we grow the economy, if we grow the jobs and if the welfare system does not lock people out of a job and provide a disincentive for them to leave welfare and go into a job. Then I think we can repeat that performance. I mean Pat McGorry today has an excellent piece in the Herald Sun and I commend all readers to it. Where he says that people with a mental health challenge and illness, their condition is not always permanent. It can be transitory, they will move in and out of the workforce potentially. But if we put them on a payment which says set and forget, we don’t need you to participate in the economy then I think that is the wrong message, and I don’t think that is the message they want to hear and I think that what they want to do is be actively involved in the workforce in society, and I think we have to encourage that and I think Pat is doing great work in that area.
MITCHELL:
So how do you do that, do you review them regularly?
MINISTER MORRISON:
No, what Pat has suggested let me just use his policy as an example. He is talking about having a more interrelated relationship between people who are putting people into jobs and people who are helping people with their health in those situations directly within many of the headspace clinics that are around the country. See because what they have found is it takes a team to get someone well again and part of the team should be someone who is helping them get a job and stick in a job. Because sometimes, and I was talking to some employers this week, if someone with a disability goes and gets taken up into a job effectively the responsibility shifts all the way to the employer and they have to carry them through. Now what employers are telling me and people who are helping people with mental illness are telling me is there needs to be a bridge of continuity over that process so you can help them stick in there.
MITCHELL:
There is a perception that there is a lot of rorting going on. If 80 per cent of taxpayers are paying the welfare bill what percentage of them is their money going to rorts? How much of that bill is rorting?
MINISTER MORRISON:
It is a fair question and it is one that I haven’t been able to get a straight answer to yet. But what I do know is that we need to tighten up on the ICT system, the computer system which drives our payments, we need to do a lot more data matching which helps us find out who may be working the system and working with our other departments and agencies. Senator Payne, Minister Payne and I are working on a package of measures which will help us tighten up in that area because the system has to have integrity. 8 out of 10 taxpayers have to know that if their tax dollars are being spent then I as a Minister are ensuring that people aren’t rorting it.
MITCHELL:
Are you able to estimate? You have got $150 billion, you could wave a magic wand, all rorting stops how much does the bill come down?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well that is what I said I haven’t got a straight answer.
MITCHELL:
So you don’t know?
MINISTER MORRISON:
I don’t have a straight answer to it yet from those who run the system. I don’t think it is 50 per cent, I don’t think it is 30 per cent but it is something less than that. But if it is one per cent then people need to be confident that I will go after it.