Transcript by The Hon Scott Morrison MP

ABC AM with Michael Brissenden

Program: ABC AM

E&OE

MICHAEL BRISSENDEN:

Scott Morrison, we’ll get to the broader budget issue shortly, but first to pensions. They are going up again and you do trumpet this every time but you do still want to change the indexation arrangement, don’t you that could mean future rises won’t be so generous?

MINISTER MORRISON:

The good news is pensions are up, Michael, they’re up today by $5.90 for a single and $8.80 for a couple. But more importantly since we were elected, since the last election, pensions have gone up $78 a fortnight for couples. Now, on top of that, we have also kept the carbon tax compensation which for a single pensioner it was worth over $14 a fortnight. So, what it means is we’ve had the increase to the pension on CPI and the other measures since the budget which means they’re up over six per cent which is a higher rate of growth than wages since the last election and we’ve got rid of the carbon tax but they kept the carbon tax compensation. Now, if we’d only indexed pensions by MTAWE, if that had happened since the last election then pensioners would be over $20 worse off a fortnight.

BRISSENDEN:

Ok, but if you do change the indexation there is a possibility that the future increases wouldn’t be so generous, isn’t there?

MINISTER MORRISON:

That’s a discussion which is continuing with the Senate and crossbenchers and others. But what’s more important about that discussion is how we have a sustainable and adequate pension for the future. I don’t know how many times, Michael, I’m prepared to consider any number of options and arrangements here which get us to that outcome and I think those discussions are positive and so I’m not going to get ahead of myself here on where this ends up. But what we do want is an adequate and a sustainable and a fair pension for the future; that’s what we’re focused on. The Labor Party has a plan to do just nothing, not acknowledge the challenges that are ahead and run the pension off the edge of a cliff.

BRISSENDEN:

Ok, well the crossbench though has signalled that it is against the indexation changes, it looks like your plans are headed for defeat in the Senate. You’re going to have significant political pain, aren’t you for perhaps not much fiscal gain?

MINISTER MORRISON:

Michael, I announced something that we were talking about on Saturday and you’re already within just a couple of days ready to call the whistle on it. Now, I’m not surprised you might take view, but nevertheless, it’s a discussion that goes on over a long period of time because any measures that we’re contemplating or proposing here don’t come into effect until 2017. So, this thing doesn’t have to be wrapped up in the next week, Michael, and I think frankly to leap to that analysis so quickly I don’t think really fairly gives credit for the type of genuine conversation we’re having. You don’t do that in a couple of days, Michael, you do it over a period of time and you try and solve a problem which is what we’re doing.

BRISSENDEN:

Ok, your conversations with the crossbench on other issues haven’t been so successful either in the last few months, have they? So it’s hardly surprising that people would jump to conclusions and suggest that the crossbench may be stuck and that this legislation could be headed for defeat?

MINISTER MORRISON:

Well, Michael, the legislation on that matter hasn’t even been introduced, but I’m not surprised you’ve jumped to a conclusion.

BRISSENDEN:

Alright. Have you dropped the ball on hard budget reform in other areas?

MINISTER MORRISON:

No, we’re maintaining right across the board the measures that we believe that we can continue to pursue and that we believe can be put through the Senate at some point. I think that’s important because we have been able to halve the projection on where Labor’s debt was taking us. Labor are in complete denial where they were taking this country fiscally. They were fiscal arsonists when it came to the budget and now they’re blaming the firemen which is this Government, the Abbott Government, coming and putting that fire out. We’ve had to use the full pressure hose in the first budget and that has had a very significant impact. Yeah we might have bit off a bit more than we could chew in that first budget and we’re obviously moderating that position as we move into a second budget. But I think it has to be acknowledged that we made a lot of progress in that first budget and we were able to knock out the size of Labor’s projected debt by half.

BRISSENDEN:

Doesn’t it also have to be acknowledged that the bottom-line for the current budget year has deteriorated from a forecast deficit of around $20/24 billion or so to about $40 billion now?

MINISTER MORRISON:

Well, there are a number of measures that haven’t passed and it’s…

BRISSENDEN:

Well, precisely. So how can you argue that the position is better than it was?

MINISTER MORRISON:

Well, Michael, because we had the measures and plans in place to try and get these issues fixed. Now, if the Labor Party want to frustrate they can do that, but they’ve got to offer up alternative savings. See, the rules are the same for us as they are for the Opposition. We’ve got measures on the table and I’ve said this in my own area, if they’ve got better measures or better ways of dealing with the problems – fine, put them on the table. But in the year of ideas from Bill Shorten, I still haven’t seen one. All I’ve heard is unfunded empathy from Bill Shorten. If you want to go and do something in the budget, Bill, put up a proposal that you can fund and don’t put your head in the sand as the Intergenerational Report says there at great risk of doing, the outcomes of putting your head in the sand on these issues and Labor isn’t turning up to the debate with anything serious.

BRISSENDEN:

Don’t the budget papers also show that even before you dumped the Medicare co-payment and the uni spending cuts, the cumulative budget deficits from 2015 to 18 have now blown out by $80 billion?

MINISTER MORRISON:

Well, there are a range of issues that are contributing to that. As you know, Michael, there are revenue issues that relate to that…

BRISSENDEN:

But this is the budget situation under your Government.

MINISTER MORRISON:

And you deal with the revenue issues that hit you at the time, Michael, but you also go forward with a plan for structured, modest, incremental savings that deal with the problem over time which the Intergenerational Report shows is what we’re achieving. We’ve halved Labor’s…

BRISSENDEN:

But you can’t argue that the budget situation is getting better, can you?

MINISTER MORRISON:

…over the forward term.

BRISSENDEN:

But you can’t then argue that the budget situation is getting better, can you?

MINISTER MORRISON:

We can’t definitely argue that over the longer term we’ve halved Labor’s projected debt. We are on a path based on the measures that we’re putting forward that would take us eventually down the track to a position of surplus. Now, Labor doesn’t have such a plan and with politics as you know, Michael, it’s always a question of alternatives. We’ve got a plan to get us there; Labor has no plan at all, unfunded empathy, going round talking to everyone who might have an issue and not having a plan to fund the solution. We’re there, we’re part of the discussion, we’re part of the debate, we’re part of fixing the problem, Labor’s not even there.

BRISSENDEN:

Can you understand why economists and others might be a little concerned when you’ve got a year ago it was a budget crisis and now you’ve got the Prime Minister out there saying a ratio of debt to GDP at around 50 or 60 per cent is a pretty good result.

MINISTER MORRISON:

Well, that’s what Labor just said, you just had Anthony Albanese saying that, so you’re effectively quoting Anthony Albanese. But what we are saying is that in the first budget we were able to halve the projection on Labor’s debt because of the measures we took. Now, we do think that’s a good start, I would hope you too and your listeners would. We have already halved the fiscal chaos that Labor left us and I think that’s a good start, but we’ve got more work to, there’s no doubt about that and Labor aren’t part of the plan to try and help us do that because they work against every measure. Let me give you an example, the previous government cut $15 billion in Family Tax Benefit payments, $15 billion. Now we have a modest measure which deals with only around $5 billion compared to that which do exactly the same thing Labor was doing, freezing payments for particular benefits and indexation threshold freezing.

BRISSENDEN:

Ok, Scott Morrison…

MINISTER MORRISON:

Same thing Labor did and they’ve opposed that. So, frankly, they’re hypocrites.

BRISSENDEN:

Alright Mr Morrison, thanks very much for joining us.

MINISTER MORRISON:

Thanks, Michael.