ABC 7.30
E&OE
LEIGH SALES:
The Social Services Minister Scott Morrison joins me now from our Parliament House studio in Canberra. Minister, thank you very much for your time.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Thanks, Leigh.
SALES:
The Coalition’s current position on same-sex marriage is a binding vote opposing any change. Do you think that that position will help or hinder you at the next federal election?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well the party’s position is to affirm the current definition of the Marriage Act, which came in in 2004 and that’s our position. But where we got to the other night, Leigh, was to say that this question really ultimately, fundamentally, is one that should be determined by the Australian people. Now…
SALES:
And – sorry could we just return to my original point, which is do you think that position will help or hinder you at the next election?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, that’s not really what it’s about. What it’s about is affirming or not affirming a current policy position and the current policy position was affirmed. But the question at the next election is about who will decide this matter on the other side of the election and our view is that the Australian people should decide that, not politicians, not judges, but the people of Australia.
SALES:
But the people of Australia decide when they elect you to be their representative in the Parliament. We don’t go to the people with a plebiscite or a referendum on every single issue. We assume that the people that we’ve elected will make that decision.
MINISTER MORRISON:
No, we don’t do that, but in extraordinary cases when you have issues that are deeply felt within the country, I think there is a very strong case for ordinary Australians to be able to have their view, and I’ll give you this reason in my electorate, people know my views, but my view isn’t the point. I cannot reflect through my vote the view of every person of the 100,000-odd electors in my electorate. There are people in my electorate who don’t share my view and I think they should have a voice as well. Equally, in Tony Burke’s electorate, he cannot share the view, because he supports same-sex marriage, the views of the 20 per cent-odd people in his electorate who are of the Muslim faith or the 10 per cent who are of the Eastern Orthodox faith and I suspect a good proportion of the almost 30 per cent of Catholics in his seat. So, what I’m saying is it shouldn’t be about my view or Tony Burke’s view or Bill Shorten’s view or Tony Abbott’s view. It should be about your view, Leigh, and all your listeners who we believe should decide this issue, not us and not judges.
SALES:
If there is a referendum or a plebiscite, what’s the question going to be?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I think there are a number of options and that’s the process I believe we would work through as we consider how we can put this issue to the Australian people, but I’ll give you…
SALES:
And who would decide what the question would be?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well that would be decided by the Government, as any…
SALES:
You wouldn’t have an independent panel or a panel made up of members of the Government and Opposition?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, Leigh these are all good suggestions and I think these are important things that could be considered, but the type of issue that could be canvassed under Section 51 of the Constitution simply at the moment in Clause 21, it just says “marriage”. Now you could equally put in there “opposite and same-sex marriage” and clarify very clearly what the meaning of the Constitution is on this question and to reflect that some would argue has been a societal change since the Constitution was first written. Now, justices of the High Court have already expressed opinions on this issue. That’s fine, but what I’m saying is that I would prefer the Australian people decide this, not me, not Justice French, but the Australian people.
SALES:
In yesterday’s meeting, did you warn of the quote “bigotry of secularism” and what did you mean by that?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, the other reason I’m in favour of a referendum, and this goes to your question, I don’t think we’ve been having a very even-handed debate on this issue. I mean, when you have a situation when it’s reported that there are two commercial television networks won’t allow the running of an advertisement that simply supports the existing law, then I worry, I really worry about what might happen if we were to change this law, and as a result, what people of different religious views, not just Christian, but Islamic views, views of Hindi, views of Sikhs, views of Jews, views of all different religions…
SALES:
And what do you think could happen?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well what I’m worried about is if anyone was simply expressing their religious view on this question, they would be in fact branded a bigot. They would be in fact branded someone who didn’t share an equality of view recognising the differences of opinions and beliefs of other people. What I’m concerned about, Leigh is when you have a referendum, there is an opportunity for both sides of this debate to be fairly put to the Australian people, for all of the issues to be fully considered and presented I think in an even-handed way. Once we’ve done that, what it’ll do, Leigh, is produce an outcome and I want to see an outcome. I want to see this issue resolved in a way that all Australians can accept and I don’t think having politicians decide that or justices decide that will achieve that outcome.
SALES:
You’ve been Social Services Minister for a while, so by now you would have seen all sorts of different families. You would have seen that having a mum and a dad is no guarantee of a loving and safe environment. Do you agree that it’s the character of parents, not their sexuality that determines the strength of the family unit?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, Leigh that is not why I’m advocating a referendum.
SALES:
No, but I’m just asking you – I’m just asking your view about that. As Social Services Minister, you see a lot of different sorts of family.
MINISTER MORRISON:
I do, Leigh, and I think we have people do extraordinary things in all types of families all around the country.
SALES:
And is it the case that it’s the character of the parents, not their sexuality that determines the sorts of things that they do?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I’m going let others commentate on that because I’m not seeking to argue a case tonight to prosecute my…
SALES:
But why wouldn’t you comment on that?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Because, Leigh, what I’m arguing is it’s not my view that counts, it’s the Australian people’s view that counts and that’s why I want to see a referendum.
SALES:
But you’re an elected representative and so your view – your view is important and people would be interested in it.
MINISTER MORRISON:
I think there are strong families all across the country, but I have a strong…
SALES:
Gay families as well?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well I think there are strong families all around the country and people find themselves in couples where they have been adopted into those relationships and they have parents of the same sex. They will find themselves in families where they have heterosexual parents and their biological parents. They may be their adoptive parents. There are single parents. I think every parent in this country does the best possible job they can do, but I also believe that if there is the druthers, if there is the opportunity for children in particular whose rights I’m most interested in this, then I’ve always had a strong view about having a heterosexual relationship to provide the cornerstone of the family. They’re my personal views, Leigh, and I’m not going to impose those on the rest of the country. I’m going to say everyone’s views should be considered equally in this debate and that’s why we need a referendum.
SALES:
Well just one final question. You are touted as a future leader. Would you give the Liberal party room a free vote on this if you were leader?
MINISTER MORRISON:
I supported the position that came out of the party room last night and I spoke in favour of it.
SALES:
You don’t think there should be a free vote then?
MINISTER MORRISON:
Well, think about this, Leigh I don’t think a vote in this Parliament is going to end this issue. That’s why I’m a proponent of a referendum because I believe that is the best way to get to a conclusion on this issue which all Australians can accept. I don’t want this issue to divide Australians, but I do want the issue settled and I think a referendum is the best way to achieve that outcome.
SALES:
Scott Morrison, thank you very much for your time tonight.
MINISTER MORRISON:
Thanks very much, Leigh.